Following Attacks, Spain's Governing Party Is Beaten By ELAINE SCIOLINO
Published: March 15, 2004
ADRID, March 14 — Spain's opposition Socialists swept to an upset victory in general elections on Sunday, ousting the center-right party of Prime Minister José María Aznar in a groundswell of voter anger and grief over his handling of terrorist bombings in Madrid last week.
Investigators reported Sunday that there was growing evidence of involvement of Muslim fundamentalists in the attacks. They said one of five men arrested in the bombings had been linked to a suspected cell of Al Qaeda in Spain, and a Spanish antiterrorism official said several of the men had been under surveillance before the attacks.
The bombings, the deadliest terror attack in Europe since World War II, turned on its head what just a few days ago seemed to be a likely victory by Mr. Aznar's Popular Party. Some voters apparently believed that Al Qaeda had plotted the attacks to punish Mr. Aznar for supporting the war, which Spaniards overwhelmingly opposed.
With each new bit of information about the investigation into the attack came accusations that Mr. Aznar's party may have tried to suppress evidence of possible Qaeda involvement by assuming that Basque separatists were responsible.
In addition to the men who have been arrested, the Spanish authorities were investigating the possible involvement in the plot of other militant Muslims previously known to Spanish intelligence officials.
One official said investigators were examining how militants active in Spain may have joined with others from abroad to carry out the attack.
The threat of terrorism became more of a reality to many in Europe. In Germany, the government held an emergency meeting of its security cabinet. Interior Minister Otto Schily said Germany was asking for an emergency gathering of European police and security officials to form what he called a "common assessment" of the terrorism danger and to "coordinate how to respond."
The Socialist victory in Spain was seen as a repudiation of Mr. Aznar, whose party has been in office for eight years, and his close bonds with President Bush. It also posed a new problem for the American-led occupation force in Iraq, where Spain has 1,300 troops, because the Socialists have said they will withdraw them in the absence of a clear United Nations mandate.
Rage at the government overshadowed Election Day. Protesters shouted "Liar!" and "Get our troops out of Iraq!" at the Popular Party candidate Mariano Rajoy, the 48-year-old lawyer who had been expected to be Mr. Aznar's successor, as he voted at a Madrid polling station.
José Luis Rodríguez Zapatero, the 43-year-old lawyer who will become prime minister, accepted victory at his party's campaign headquarters by asking for a moment of silence for the bombing victims.
He called for "restrained euphoria" in light of the bombings, which killed 200 people and wounded 1,500 on four commuter trains in Madrid on Thursday.
"Terror should know that it has all of us in front of it and we will conquer it," he said. "I will lead a quiet change. I will govern for all in unity. And power will not change me, I promise you that."
In his speech conceding defeat, Mr. Rajoy praised Mr. Zapatero as a "worthy opponent" and pledged that the Popular Party would be "a loyal opposition always serving the interests of Spain."
But Mr. Rajoy noted that the election had been "inexorably marked by the atrocious attack" of terrorism. Mr. Aznar, who had hand-picked Mr. Rajoy as his successor, stood solemnly at his side.
The arrest of three Moroccans and two Indians and an official announcement, just hours before the polls opened, of a videotape in which a man claimed that Al Qaeda had carried out the bombings prompted accusations that the government was lying when it claimed that the violent Basque separatist movement ETA was most likely responsible.
In November, Mr. Zapatero called for the withdrawal of Spanish troops from Iraq after the death of seven Spanish secret service agents in an ambush. More recently, he softened his position, saying that if he won the election, he would withdraw the troops at the end of June unless a United Nations-led force took charge.
RE: virus: The shape of things to come?
« Reply #1 on: 2004-03-15 08:50:36 »
I see it differently B.
The Spanish (well a small majority) have fallen victim to the fallacy of appeasement. Prior to the bombings the Popular Party were on course for a comfortable win. The bombers (I suspect an ETA/Al Qaeda cooperative effort) have had a major success in stunning the masses into capitulation and terror-directed reaction.
See this superb post for an interesting viewpoint.
one question... where were the happy maases in pakistan, iran and palistine now? After the terrorism of 9-11 happy people were cheering all over the world that the USA finaly got what they deserved. Of course I don't degree with them... Does any US citizen understand why they are not cheering now? Why the normal people in most muslim country now condem these actions though they condemed the support of spain tho the war on iraq? Ofcourse there are some people happy about the train bombing but not half as glad as they where after the 9-11 actions and not half as manny people.
U. beata
>From: "Jonathan Davis" <jonathan.davis@lineone.net> >Reply-To: virus@lucifer.com >To: <virus@lucifer.com> >Subject: RE: virus: The shape of things to come? >Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:50:36 -0000 > >I see it differently B. > >The Spanish (well a small majority) have fallen victim to the fallacy of >appeasement. Prior to the bombings the Popular Party were on course for a >comfortable win. The bombers (I suspect an ETA/Al Qaeda cooperative effort) >have had a major success in stunning the masses into capitulation and >terror-directed reaction. > >See this superb post for an interesting viewpoint. > >The Ichneumon Wasp >http://belmontclub.blogspot.com/2004_03_01_belmontclub_archive.html#10792189 >8009995819 > >Regards > >Limbic > > > > > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-virus@lucifer.com [mailto:owner-virus@lucifer.com] On Behalf Of >Blunderov >Sent: 15 March 2004 09:57 >To: virus@lucifer.com >Subject: RE: virus: The shape of things to come? > >[Blunderov] >Apparently the electorate is capable of expressing it's disapproval of >being >lied to. Blair and Bush next, Darwin willing. >Best regards > >http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/15/international/europe/15SPAI.html?th > >Following Attacks, Spain's Governing Party Is Beaten By ELAINE >SCIOLINOlucifer.com/cgi-bin/virus-l> > >--- >To unsubscribe from the Virus list go to ><http://www.lucifer.com/cgi-bin/virus-l>
_________________________________________________________________ MSN Zoeken helpt je om de gekste dingen te vinden! http://search.msn.nl
Your friend, Walter --------------------------------- Jonathan Davis wrote:
> I see it differently B. > > The Spanish (well a small majority) have fallen victim to the fallacy of > appeasement. Prior to the bombings the Popular Party were on course for a > comfortable win. The bombers (I suspect an ETA/Al Qaeda cooperative effort) > have had a major success in stunning the masses into capitulation and > terror-directed reaction. > > See this superb post for an interesting viewpoint. > > The Ichneumon Wasp > http://belmontclub.blogspot.com/2004_03_01_belmontclub_archive.html#10792189 > 8009995819 > > Regards > > Limbic > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-virus@lucifer.com [mailto:owner-virus@lucifer.com] On Behalf Of > Blunderov > Sent: 15 March 2004 09:57 > To: virus@lucifer.com > Subject: RE: virus: The shape of things to come? > > [Blunderov] > Apparently the electorate is capable of expressing it's disapproval of being > lied to. Blair and Bush next, Darwin willing. > Best regards > > http://www.nytimes.com/2004/03/15/international/europe/15SPAI.html?th > > Following Attacks, Spain's Governing Party Is Beaten By ELAINE > SCIOLINOlucifer.com/cgi-bin/virus-l> > > --- > To unsubscribe from the Virus list go to <http://www.lucifer.com/cgi-bin/virus-l>
--
Walter Watts Tulsa Network Solutions, Inc.
"Pursue the small utopias... nature, music, friendship, love" --Kupferberg--
RE: virus: The shape of things to come?
« Reply #4 on: 2004-03-15 17:10:16 »
>From: "Jonathan Davis" <jonathan.davis@lineone.net> >Reply-To: virus@lucifer.com >To: <virus@lucifer.com> >Subject: RE: virus: The shape of things to come? >Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2004 13:50:36 -0000 > >I see it differently B. > >The Spanish (well a small majority) have fallen victim to the fallacy of >appeasement. Prior to the bombings the Popular Party were on course for a >comfortable win. The bombers (I suspect an ETA/Al Qaeda cooperative effort) >have had a major success in stunning the masses into capitulation and >terror-directed reaction.
[Blunderov]I don't quite follow. Surely it is the MAJORITY that has, as you put it, fallen victim to the fallacy of appeasement? Are you blaming the swing vote but absolving the rest? If so, why?
I know of no evidence linking ETA and al Quaeda. Do you have any? The possibility seems to me to be even more remote than that of al Quaeda forming an alliance with Iraq. ETA, I am told, are Marxist separatists. I can't imagine how their interests might coincide. Are they Muslim Marxists?
In any case, while it is possible that al Quaeda may construe this result as being an appeasement, I suspect that he message of the Spanish electorate was intended not for al Quaeda but for the ears of their own government. The actual message was something like 'An overwhelming majority of us didn't want you to support Bushism. You went ahead and did it anyway and these are the fruits. And then you tried to lie to us by claiming it was the work of the Basques when you knew full well that it wasn't. With all these many lies you cynically held the harmony of your own nation hostage to your personal political convenience and then expected to be returned to office. Think again!'?
I would bet money that both Bush and Blair got THIS message loud and clear.
RE: virus: The shape of things to come?
« Reply #6 on: 2004-03-16 06:12:27 »
Hi B,
I see it differently.
The Socialist prime minister ought to thank Al Qaeda in his acceptance speech.
The swing vote is crucial. In a close election an act of terrible violence has swung an election. If the Socialists were voted in simply because the majority were protesting against being defied or the Iraq war, I would be sorry about the result but fully accept the democratic result.
I supported the war, I rejected the populist anti-war stance and I especially think it is downright insane to think of leaving Iraqis to their fate now. That said I would understand that the people are angry about being defied (even if though I think the government was brave and right to defy them).
That is not what happened.
The conservatives were on course for an easy victory and the bombing swung it. That is terrifying.
Thanks to the Spanish people, we can be next to certain that Al Qaeda will redouble their efforts to kill Americans and Britons at election time knowing as they do now that Europeans at least have no mettle.
Tony Blair knew full well that his decisions in Iraq were deeply unpopular, but he did what he believed was the right thing.
I believe it is utterly the right thing and I believe the Spanish have surrendered. If a year ago the coalition he not invaded, Saddam - a mass murderer just like the bombers - would still be in power. The people of Iraq would still be enthralled. Saddam would still be supporting Hamas and other terrorists. Libya Iran and North Korea would not have started to cooperate as they are now. And Al Quaeda might have bombed Madrid but blamed it on...
1. Support for America in War on Terror 2. Kicking out Moors on 1492 3. Insufficient zeal in hating Americans 4. Hosting Tony Blair at a summit 5. 700 years unpaid rent to the Khalif 6. Supporting moderates in Morocco 7. Supporting moderates in Algeria
You get the picture.
I like this news, it trumps all the other faux-disaster propaganda:
[Blunderov]I don't quite follow. Surely it is the MAJORITY that has, as you put it, fallen victim to the fallacy of appeasement? Are you blaming the swing vote but absolving the rest? If so, why?
I know of no evidence linking ETA and al Quaeda. Do you have any? The possibility seems to me to be even more remote than that of al Quaeda forming an alliance with Iraq. ETA, I am told, are Marxist separatists. I can't imagine how their interests might coincide. Are they Muslim Marxists?
In any case, while it is possible that al Quaeda may construe this result as being an appeasement, I suspect that he message of the Spanish electorate was intended not for al Quaeda but for the ears of their own government. The actual message was something like 'An overwhelming majority of us didn't want you to support Bushism. You went ahead and did it anyway and these are the fruits. And then you tried to lie to us by claiming it was the work of the Basques when you knew full well that it wasn't. With all these many lies you cynically held the harmony of your own nation hostage to your personal political convenience and then expected to be returned to office. Think again!'?
I would bet money that both Bush and Blair got THIS message loud and clear.
RE: virus: The shape of things to come?
« Reply #8 on: 2004-03-18 12:43:45 »
"The puppy likes spoor, does not like lion" - African Proverb
-----Original Message----- From: owner-virus@lucifer.com [mailto:owner-virus@lucifer.com] On Behalf Of Erik Aronesty Sent: 18 March 2004 13:42 To: Church of Virus Subject: Re: virus: The shape of things to come?
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