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Describe VirianCouncil-2003-09-02 here.

<hermit> Good morning <Shadow> yes, good morning.

<Shadow> hm? <hermit> That was the way that I perceived it anyway. <Shadow> hmmm. <hermit> hmmmm. <hermit> Shadow: Now, speak about about your selected means of communication... or non-communication. <Shadow> oh. yeah. snideness. <Shadow> yeah that sounds like a standard operating procedure in one of my "grumpy" moods.

<hermit> It's ok Kid-A, we still love you <hermit> Shadow, please refrain in future. <Shadow> But basically I think I need to rewrite that poll, because "incest" aside, I think some people didn't quite understand what I was trying to say <Shadow> hah, yeah, right. <hermit> Be grumpy to David & I in person, on IRC, even on the wiki. <Shadow> I make no promises. :-) <Kid-A> poll? what poll? did i miss a poll?

<Kid-A> holy cow <Shadow> I still had a point to "incest", but right now explaining that would probably violate doctors orders. <hermit> ? <hermit> Too much keyboard use? <Shadow> I still had a point. <Shadow> yeah. <hermit> SHit <Shadow> I'm not joking.

<hermit> It's supposed to be good for the prostate <hermit> Ok, I'm listening <Shadow> well, its certainly not democratic. <hermit> Nobody has said anything about democracy. <Shadow> it doesn't even really provide a result that is necessarily embraced by most of the people. <hermit> Except that it is a bad idea. <hermit> Which is why we have a sumucracy

<hermit> And it seems to be. <Shadow> "sumucracy"? <hermit> httphttp://virus.lucifer.com/wiki/sumucracy <Shadow> hmmm. <hermit> Shadow - which is why the wiki. Which is a continuation of the Codex comnbined with another year of off line discussion, as well as the IRL discussion as well as the IRC discussions... <Kid-A> i c we r talking about the rep system again? <Shadow> Kid, yeah. <hermit> Kid-A - here httphttp://virus.lucifer.com/wiki/VirianReputation <Shadow> I don't envision this performing the same function as the "virian council". I agree that its a nice way to see what "popular virians" are thinking about, but it doesn't seem either 1) transparent or 2) conducive to much deliberation which democracy IS about . . . and a good thing I might add. <Shadow> I don't see everyone in Virus having "a vote". but I do think that some sort of council should itself operate in a more democratic fashion than this. <hermit> Why? <hermit> Are you saying "all men are equal? <Shadow> no i'm not. <hermit> The democracy lies in the fact that anyone can earn a reputation. <hermit> And remarkably quickly. <hermit> The truth of that is highly visible on the board. <hermit> If you look at the actual value of any one person (including the respected) it is relatively small. <hermit> You need to look. <hermit> Here httphttp://virus.lucifer.com/bbs/index.php?action=repIndex <Shadow> I have. <hermit> Taking 1.5% as an arbitrary cut-off: <hermit> httphttp://virus.lucifer.com/bbs/index.php?action=repIndex <Shadow> I'm not suggesting something INSTEAD of the reputation/voting system, I'm suggesting something in addition to it.

<hermit> Second last column is equity

<hermit> Notice that aside from David at 15%, the next 5 have only 25% of the total equity. <Shadow> Okay Hermit, imagine this now . . . . <hermit> In other words, the council (top 6) currently commands less than 40% of the vote.

<hermit> Listening carefully. <Shadow> right, The Council. <Shadow> not really a formal entity. <Shadow> yet <hermit> Right <Shadow> but certainly the reputation system might suggest some names that will more likely than not be on it. <Shadow> I think a real formal council is a necessary balance to this voting reputation system.

<hermit> As you have seen, it is in progress <hermit> httphttp://virus.lucifer.com/wiki/VirianCouncil <Shadow> It doesn't matter so much if a few members do nothing more than offer their equity. <hermit> I hope that it doesn't get back to that situation. <hermit> If it does, the equity only people are likely to sag rather rapidly IMO,,, <Shadow> that's reality Hermit. <hermit> We've been there before

--> rhino (rhino@212.205.234.191) has joined #hermit

<Shadow> And we will probably be there again. <hermit> And we can play musical chairs - quite transparently, if we have to <hermit> Hi Rhino <hermit> How do you like my one-liners? <rhino> hey hermit, Shadow <Kid-A> hey rhino <rhino> ah, they should be handy for the nix folks <rhino> hey Kid

<Shadow> Still, even of those who would be "window dressing" do frequently enough make a good point or express a relevant opinion. After all they probably didn't get equity for doing absolutely nothing in the first place.

--> Lucifer (nemo@24.244.36.179) has joined #hermit

<Shadow> welcome, Lucifer. <hermit> Jake doesn't want to type too much, so I'll toss you a log afterwards Lucifer <hermit> She's off. <hermit> I'll edit and post to the wiki <rhino> good, because i have no idea what it was about

Version 6, saved on Tuesday, September 2, 2003 11:05:01 am.