On 19 Aug 2002 at 19:20, Mermaid . wrote:
> A drunk non-combatant at that! Running amok on a multi million dollar
> 60 tonne D-9 bulldozer. UNDER OFFICIAL ORDERS! We might want to look
> at the definition of 'combatant'. With a little thought, one might
> even want to redefine 'army' and 'military' when it comes to Israel. A
> "non-combatant" Israeli says in..
>
> http://www.gush-shalom.org/archives/kurdi_eng.html
>
> "What is 'opening a track'? You erase buildings. On both sides. There
> is no other choice, because the bulldozer was much wider than their
> alleys. But I am not looking for excuses or anything. You must 'shave'
> them. I didn't give a damn about demolishing their houses, because it
> saved the lives of our soldiers. I worked where our soldiers were
> slaughtered. They didn't tell all the truth about what happened. they
> drilled holes in the walls, holes for gun barrels. Anyone who escaped
> the charges, was shot through these holes."
>
> "I had no mercy for anybody. I would erase anyone with the D-9, just
> so that our soldiers won't expose themselves to danger. That's what I
> told them. I was afraid for our soldiers. You could see them sleeping
> together, 40 soldiers in a house, all crowded. My heart went out for
> them. This is why I didn't give a damn about demolishing all the
> houses I've demolished - and I have demolished plenty. By the end, I
> built the 'Teddy' football stadium there."
>
> "Difficult? No way. You must be kidding. I wanted to destroy
> everything. I begged the officers, over the radio, to let me knock it
> all down; from top to bottom. To level everything. It's not as if I
> wanted to kill. Just the houses. We didn't harm those who came out of
> the houses we had started to demolish, waving white flags. We screwed
> just those who wanted to fight."
>
> "No one refused an order to knock down a house. No such thing. When I
> was told to bring down a house, I took the opportunity to bring down
> some more houses; not because I wanted to - but because when you are
> asked to demolish a house, some other houses usually obscure it, so
> there is no other way. I would have to do it even if I didn't want to.
> They just stood in the way. If I had to erase a house, come hell or
> high water - I would do it. And believe me, we demolished too little.
> The whole camp was littered with detonation charges. What actually
> saved the lives of the Palestinians themselves, because if they had
> returned to their homes, they would blow up."
>
> "For three days, I just destroyed and destroyed. The whole area. Any
> house that they fired from came down. And to knock it down, I tore
> down some more. They were warned by loudspeaker to get out of the
> house before I come, but I gave no one a chance. I didn't wait. I
> didn't give one blow, and wait for them to come out. I would just ram
> the house with full power, to bring it down as fast as possible. I
> wanted to get to the other houses. To get as many as possible. Others
> may have restrained themselves, or so they say. Who are they kidding?
> Anyone who was there, and saw our soldiers in the houses, would
> understand they were in a death trap. I thought about saving them. I
> didn't give a damn about the Palestinians, but I didn't just ruin with
> no reason. It was all under orders."
>
> "Many people where inside houses we stto demolish. They would come out
> of the houses we were working on. I didn't see, with my own eyes,
> people dying under the blade of the D-9. and I didn't see house
> falling down on live people. But if there were any, I wouldn't care at
> all. I am sure people died inside these houses, but it was difficult
> to see, there was lots of dust everywhere, and we worked a lot at
> night. I found joy with every house that came down, because I knew
> they didn't mind dying, but they cared for their homes. If you knocked
> down a house, you buried 40 or 50 people for generations. If I am
> sorry for anything, it is for not tearing the whole camp down."
>
> More:
> http://www.gush-shalom.org/archives/kurdi_eng.html
>
> <snip>
> Comments by Gush Shalom on the interview:
>
> This is the incredible, self-told Story of Moshe Nissim, a fanatic
> football fan
>
> and a permanent troublemaker, who begged his commanders in the
> reserves unit for a chance to take part in "the action".
>
> By "action" he was referring to the wide scale destruction carried out
> by the Israeli army in many Palestinian locations, especially in the
> Jenin Refugee camp.
>
> He was sent into Jenin, riding a 60 ton demolition bulldozer - and
> equipped with 16 years of pent-up personal frustration, plenty of
> whisky and only two hours of training on that armored tool.
>
> "Enough training to drive forwards and make a flat surface", as he
> himself testifies in the interview.
>
> His story may be extreme, and this man must answer to many serious
> questions, but Moshe Nissim is not much different from thousands of
> other frustrated and violent football fans, who terrorize cities in
> Europe after a football match.
>
> But then again, Of course, it is unconceivable, that the British army
> would send a drunken and frustrated Manchester fan into Belfast riding
> a D-9 bulldozer.
>
> Therefore, the really troubling questions must be directed at the
> system that sent him into Jenin on this mission of destruction. This
> system is the Israeli army.
>
> What kind of army puts a 60 ton, multi-million dollar demolishing
> bulldozer in the hands of such a person, who has not operated one
> before?
>
> How could his rampage go on, without being stopped by any of the
> officers, at any rank?
>
> How can such an army insist it is the "most moral army in the world"?
>
> Does this interview shed more light on Israel's refusal to have it's
> actions in Jenin investigated?
>
> What did happen in Jenin?
>
> We hope that after reading this sickening interview, you will find
> ways of sending these questions, and others you might have, to the
> Israeli government through it's ambassadors, to the Israeli army, who,
> we are sure, will not tolerate it's fine tools being used in such a
> brutal and unlawful manner.
>
Reading the quotes did point out the ambush deathtrap nature of many
of the houses, and that those who did not fight were spared from harm.
And apparently, 52 Palestinians and 33 Israelis died in Jenin. I know
that some here would wish the numbers to be different (less Israelis,
many more Palestinians) for propaganda and personal hatred
justification purposes, but they're just shit out of luck. And what does it
say about their real care for the Palestinians, that they would wish more
Palestinians had died in Jenin just so they could rise up on their hind
limbs in self-righteous snarling indignation and tonguelash the Israelis
more?
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