Now that the "Religion" thread has officially ended, I'm going to
attempt some kind of summary of what I learned (and hopefully some of
what you learned too) The way I see it, the best orginizing principle
is what used to be a political division. I'm going to divide the
religious spectrum into "Left" "center" and "Right", and then ask some
questions about the validity of the division later.
First, on the _far_ left is the STRONG atheist, who says "There is no
God of any kind" He maintain that we as humankind are completely on our
own, the we evolved and it is entirely our own responsiblity to "invent"
a moral system. I'm not sure anyone really maintains this, but it is
the fundamental "individualist" position, similar to the political
position of anarchy.
It's important to point out here that this spectrum, like the political
one, is continious... these positions are just ones I've seen or are the
theoritical Maximum in one direction
Next is my position: "weak" atheism. "I do not beleive the Christian
God exists, or any omnipotent omniscient God" However, given that
Christianity exists and has for thousands of years, I _am_ willing to
look at the Bible (and other religious texts too, if I can find them in
a language I can read...) and /learn/ from what it has to say... after
all, if I don't let the meme's try, how can I possibly be infected?
Then comes what I beleive John's position is: The religious left (which
I'm now changing to the religious center, OK John?) This position does
exist, and is very similar to mine... I am just barely to the left of
center, and John is just barely to the right. God exists, but he is not
omnipotent or omnisicient or omnibenovelent. God's Bible serves as a
guide to life, but is NOT the "Capital T Truth" and must be intrepeted
with reason, experience and tradition. Jesus was a saviour (not divine)
who brought the great message to cast out most of the Bible as
meaningless and allow one to use intelligence in the area of morals.
And lastly is the Religious _far_ right. Fundamentalism. God is o. o.
o. The Bible is the "True" word of God and is source for condeming all
non-beleivers. The individual is nada in the face of God and exists
only to worship Him and bring others to worship Him. Only beleivers
will go to heaven. Mankind has an "orginal sin" and must rely on Jesus
to provide a way out. (thank God for Jesus!) Jesus is the Way, the
Truth and the Light (John:14-6) Sadly, this position is all too common
in the world of today.
OK. Questions:
1) is the individual vs God a valid distinction to draw here?
(can any comparisom to politics be made at all?)
1b) If this distinction /is/ valid, does it follow that there should be
a co-relation between your political stance and your religious stance?
2) Where about do you think the vast majority of people sit?
(What I see here is sort of like a line graph of the population
here's my guess:
----------
-- ------------- -----------
-- -- -------
--- -----
----------------------------------------------------------
Left center Right
Anybody have the resources to undertake a survey?
3) Anybody what to pay me to right a book on it? (hehehe)
ERiC
Insofar as I may be heard by anything, which may or may not care
what I say, I ask, if it matters, that you be forgiven for anything
you may have done or failed to do which requires forgiveness.
Conversely, if not forgiveness but something else may be required to
insure any possible benefit for which you may be eligible after the
destruction of your body, I ask that this, whatever it may be, be
granted or withheld, as the case may be, in such a manner as to insure
your receiving said benefit. I ask this in my capacity as your elected
intermediary between yourself and that which may not be yourself, but
which may have an interest in the matter of your receiving as much as
it is possible for you to receive of this thing, and which may in some
way be influenced by this ceremony. Amen.
(from the Lord of the Rings? help me out here)