RE: virus: conscious/subconscious (form. level 0)

Schneider John (
Wed, 25 Dec 1996 01:15:08 -0500

XYZ wrote:
> >Speculation is always fantasy, which is why we don't believe in
> >what we speculate. We believe in experimental facts, but not the
> >theory that told us to run the experiment.
> That simply is not true. Speculation does not involve visions of
> dragons and damsels in distress whereas fantasy does. Fantasy is
> when speculation demands the existence of phenomena that do not,
> in fact, exist.

OK. But where has memetics demanded the existence of phenomena
that do not exist? Memetics hasn't demanded much of anything as
of yet, which is why it is still speculation, not fantasy.

> >Einstein used pure speculation to advance science dramatically.
> >It was 'useful in a scientific sort of way'. Moreover, it was
> >not harmful in any way whatsoever. The other things you
> >mentioned cannot say the same.
> Was the atomic bomb useful? Thanks to Einstein, it was. What
> Einstein did was not pure speculation. It was called a thought
> experiment and it was useless until the insights brought forth
> by the experiments were verified with evidence.

It was useless to science, I agree. Getting back to memetics,
it is also rather useless directly to science (that I know of
at this moment), but we should keep in mind that some on this
list find memetics useful in other ways than scientific.
(e.g. Stephen's posts along these lines.)

(I think we've gotten beyond the limits of my current knowledge
in the dreaming debate.)

- JPSchneider