I retract the "huh?". If you cannot conceive of god (or God, or Mind) as something in which an individual human life can participate and have a formative effect upon, then the rest of your position falls into place.
-KMO
carlw wrote:
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-virus@lucifer.com
> > [mailto:owner-virus@lucifer.com]On Behalf
> > Of KMO
> > Sent: Saturday, March 20, 1999 12:07 PM
> > To: virus@lucifer.com
> > Subject: Re: virus: A few opening statements from a newcomer
> >
> >
> > carlw wrote:
> >
> > > If you respect yourself,
> > > there should be no need for a god.
> >
> > If you respect yourself, there should be no need for a <god>.
> >
> > <family>
> >
> > <community>
> >
> > <education>
> >
> > <internet>
> >
> > Huh?
> >
> >
> >
> Huh?^2
>
> I would say it is the formative effect you have upon something (yourself,
> those around you or things around you) which entitle you to self-respect.
> Simply "being" is not grounds for self-respect. I would argue that I can see
> "family" which I help create, as much as it creates me, being something
> which generates and reflects my self-respect. The same goes for community,
> education and even (stretching it slightly) the Internet communities I am a
> participant in and thus the Internet.
>
> I cannot see how this could apply to a god. Any god "is that it is" and you
> are suppossed to acknowledge it (Refer Growth and Learning Below).
>
> Thus I do not see how you get from "If you respect yourself, there should be
> no need for a god." to the balance of your proposition.
>
> TheHermit
>
> ANNOUNCER: The Meaning of Life: Part Two: Growth and Learning.
>
> HUMPHREY WILLIAMS: ...And spotteth twice they the camels before the third
> hour, and so, the Midianites went forth to Ram Gilead in Kadesh Bilgemath,
> by Shor Ethra Regalion, to the house of Gash-Bil-Bethuel-Bazda, he who
> brought the butter dish to Balshazar and the tent peg to the house of
> Rashomon, and there slew they the goats, yea, and placed they the bits in
> little pots. Here endeth the lesson.
>
> CHAPLAIN: Let us praise God. O Lord,...
> CONGREGATION: O Lord,...
>
> CHAPLAIN: ...ooh, You are so big,...
> CONGREGATION: ...ooh, You are so big,...
>
> CHAPLAIN: ...so absolutely huge.
> CONGREGATION: ...so absolutely huge.
>
> CHAPLAIN: Gosh, we're all really impressed down here, I can tell You.
> CONGREGATION: Gosh, we're all really impressed down here, I can tell You.
>
> CHAPLAIN: Forgive us, O Lord, for this, our dreadful toadying, and...
> CONGREGATION: And barefaced flattery.
>
> CHAPLAIN: But You are so strong and, well, just so super.
> CONGREGATION: Fantastic.
>
> HUMPHREY: Amen.
> CONGREGATION: Amen.
>
> HUMPHREY: Now, two boys have been found rubbing linseed oil into the school
> cormorant. Now, some of you may feel that the cormorant does not play an
> important part in the life of the school, but I would remind you that it was
> presented to us by the Corporation of the town of Sudbury to commemorate
> Empire Day, when we try to remember the names of all those from the Sudbury
> area who so gallantly gave their lives to keep China British. So, from now
> on, the cormorant is strictly out of bounds! Oh, and Jenkins, apparently
> your mother died this morning. Chaplain.
> [organ music]
>
> CHAPLAIN and CONGREGATION: [singing]
> O Lord, please don't burn us.
> Don't grill or toast Your flock.
> Don't put us on the barbecue
> Or simmer us in stock.
> Don't braise or bake or boil us
> Or stir-fry us in a wok.
> Oh, please don't lightly poach us
> Or baste us with hot fat.
> Don't fricassee or roast us
> Or boil us in a vat,
> And please don't stick Thy servants, Lord,
> In a Rotissomat.