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Topic: ASexual, not just a sexual orientation? (Read 779 times) |
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Bass
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ASexual, not just a sexual orientation?
« on: 2006-12-10 01:23:37 » |
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The other day I stumbled upon an Asexual forum not really knowing what it was about, so I checked it out and it got me thinking... would this go beyond just sexual orientation? I mean we have males who want to be males and females that want to be male and vice-versa, then I guess we also have people that want to be both, so why not somebody who wants to be genderless? I know there is a lot of people who don't stick to the gender stereotypes and just are pretty much neither, only tied to the one gender because of the physical state.
So really I guess the question is if there are people out there that aren't attracted to males nor females is there also a gender of which people don't consider themselves of either? Perhaps they are neither and only a male or female because the human body has to pick some gender so it was just a random decision of genetics? Is there anybody here who considers themselves asexual on either an orientation level or on a gender level?
I think that the internet is the breeding ground for much of this because it always for the invisible voice and personality that is not connected to a body. This means that there suddenly becomes a division of body and mind or body and soul depending on how you wish to label things. The internet forces you to lose your body because all people see is text and that allows the creation of different personalities or the freedom of your personality.
This division only incourages the lack of gender. It also tends to the opposite as well I feel. It increases the desire to hold your gender and have you push to assert that gender. Or in possible cases chose the other. Though I do think that in most cases people try to remain themselves and will hold on to themselves in whatever form that is. I think that it ends of that you will have people not thinking about their own gender, because text is just words that does not require that. So the subconscious ends up letting it go. I doubt people really lose themselves because of that, they are strong enough to keep their division only on the internet. It sounds bad, but I think it is only the rare cases that it happens to be unhealthy. In the general case people are pretty good in dealing with it. Most people require a pronoun as well, so you end up reasserting the idea of gender on people and thus forcing it upon them.
This is because we live in a world that knows only two genders and we have words for those. There is no inbetween state for that and the internet conflicts with that. People cannot speak without the use of those words coming up eventually or else they'll be tripping over themselves. So even in this disembodied state of the internet gender remains and is forced upon people. What becomes of the confusion is the accuracy of those words. Which is where the truly genderless or multi-gender or if you will hermophrodite comes into play. It is from that need to call someone by their correct gender that you end up drawing confusion. Such an example would be myself as many know.
The empty refusal to define one's self does create a dilemma. While I see myself having a reason, in the context of the internet it probably is pretty meaningless and empty when you get down to the grit. My reasons are more influenced by the real world, as just about everything is. But that aside, I can say that until I really discovered the internet in the fashion of actually using it as a communication network to other people and transfer of ideas and information it really did not affect me. I knew who I was and there was no confusion there. But the internet changes things and for whatever reason I was open to those changes. I have experimented with both genders from a writing context, which in the internet is about all there really is to do. But from that I was able to explore both sides however deep. I hardly could say that I understand things, but it does open the eyes to other possibilities. Though because of all that I would say that I could understand to whatever small part that idea of lacking a gender or not wishing to have one.
In the scientific side of things of asexuality, there is no gender but they are able to I guess either change to suit what is required or have what they need to reproduce. Because it does become a bit of a question mark how does a non gender reproduce. There are plenty of different methods I would imagine, there is the division of cells, adaption to the situation, and some other more than likely. It is bit a smaller point to think about since this is more about the concept more than anything than the practicals of the facts that would happen as a result.
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localroger
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Re:ASexual, not just a sexual orientation?
« Reply #1 on: 2006-12-10 20:01:44 » |
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Bass, there are a huge number of "orientations" that occur other than, and in tandem with, male and female. Sexuality isn't about reproduction; it's something that evolution invented to make reproduction happen, but it's completely possible to indulge in sexuality when you know (or have even arranged to make sure) reproduction will not happen as a result.
What I think happens is that as you develop, you form images and templates that describe the world you live in. At certain points in your brain the images and templates that are formed become your "sexual imprint." In nature (which for humans would be a hunter-gatherer tribe) it's most likely that those imprints will be of members of the opposite sex, but it's not certain; a certain amount of error is tolerable (in evolutionary terms) as long as the species as a whole still reproduces. If the error isn't individually heritable it can persist despite taking its owners out of the gene pool, and this is probably why 10% or so of the population is homosexual.
There are other weirder variants, in some cases much weirder, especially now that we've made childhood so different from what we would experience naturally. We can become attached to machines, to abstractions like power relationships (sadomasochism), to textures (furry, leather, latex), and various combinations thereof.
Since we generally form these associations before we're old enough to remember (or if we are we don't realize their significance) a lot of people are probably walking around without having stumbled upon the "key" that got programmed to awaken their sexuality. These are the asexuals. It's not that they have no sexuality, it's that they don't know what it is -- or it may be something so abstract that it doesn't exist. But rest assured, the wetware is there and ready to respond to something.
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Blunderov
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Re:ASexual, not just a sexual orientation?
« Reply #2 on: 2006-12-11 01:31:50 » |
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[Blunderov] Asexuality, in a sense, can also be the result of sublimation. The Victorians were great at diverting sexual energy into empire building activities for instance and it might be argued that single sex schools have this effect as their purpose. Monasteries likwise. Many sportspersons eschew sex before critical performances in order to maximise performance. Some people find sex existentially trivial after reproduction has been achieved, or after testosterone levels have diminished*, and prefer to invest that psychic energy elsewhere instead.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sublimation_%28psychology%29
Sublimation (psychology)
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
In psychology, sublimation is a coping mechanism. It has its roots in the psychoanalytical approach, and is often also referred to as a type of defense mechanism.
Sublimation is the refocusing of psychic energy (which Sigmund Freud believed was limited) away from negative outlets to more positive outlets. These drives which cannot find an outlet are rechanneled. For example, a student who has a major upcoming test, rather than spending time and energy worrying about it, might rechannel that time and energy into studying; and a sexually perverse person who is accustomed to wasting time and energy on sex, might instead rechannel those outlets towards expressions of sexuality such as art. In Freud's classic theory, erotic energy is only allowed limited expression due to repression, and much of the remainder of a given group's erotic energy is used to develop its culture and civilization.
Freud considered this defense mechanism the most productive compared to the others that he identified (ie., repression, displacement, denial, reaction formation, intellectualization and projection). Sublimation is the process of transforming libido into "social useful" achievements, mainly art. Psychoanalysts often refer to sublimation as the only truly successful defense mechanism.
A dramatization of this method is depicted in an early episode of the American television series The Simpsons. In the episode "Moaning Lisa," Lisa Simpson, in a nihilistic desolate mood, finds solace in playing and singing the Blues.
In Psychological Science: Mind, Brain and Behavior, by Michael Gazzaniga and Todd F. Heatherton, a more sinister example is given in which a sadist becomes a surgeon or a dentist.
*Interestingly, there seems to be a direct correlation between diminishing testosterone levels with age and diminishing rates of recidivism in males.
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DJ dAndroid
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Re:ASexual, not just a sexual orientation?
« Reply #3 on: 2007-04-24 12:31:22 » |
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Interesting. I have a friend transitioning from male to female, and then another friend transitioning the other way.
I'm not sure if it relates precisely to gender at all. But on another sexual but different note, I have a close friend, a ridiculously attractive woman in her early 20's who is not only a virgin, but is (not so simply?) completely uninterested in sex. Or okay not uninterested, she has a line and understands that for the sake of keeping her partner(s) happy-she must feign some ongoing interest. But when you get down to the nuts and bolts she just... stops. She has never had an orgasm either by herself or with another (and she has tried). Mostly she views sexual activity with bemusement, no small amount of disgust, and a large amount of irony.
It interests her though. Her virginity has become something she covets, and although she is totally capable of (and even needs) long relationships and romantic love, she can see no reason to, well, go there. At whatever point early on she made (or found) a huge disconnect between herself and... lust? She plays the game just fine, and she always knows exactly what she is doing. She knows that she is straight and she certainly enjoys male attention; she dresses sexily and flirts (in her way).
Unfortunately her views on men have been partially colored by the 83267 men who have tried to get into her pants seeking to "conquer" her. She sees the usefulness in sexuality, but mostly just looks down on the "sex drive" with utter contempt. It has caused no small amount of banter, debate, and even outright fights between us because then there's me, we like sex and pr0n! 
People can't conceive of a virtue in someone else that they can't conceive of in themselves. Instead of believing you're stronger, it's so much easier to imagine you're weaker. You're addicted to self-abuse. You're a liar. People are always ready to believe the opposite of what you tell them.
Chuck Palahniuk - Survivor
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Shouldn't robots have the same right as humans to have gender and express their sexuality?
_Clayton Bailey_
http://www.claytonbailey.com/monrobot.htm
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