From: rhinoceros (rhinoceros@freemail.gr)
Date: Mon Oct 06 2003 - 11:31:02 MDT
Besides the different forms and the different perpetrators of violence,
some other things which need clarification are:
a) How should we define "primitive culture" in this discussion? By its
technological level? By the size of the social units comprising it? By
the acceptance of the western secular values? By its adherence to
tradition? Wealth? The terrain? Population density?
We also need to know how the related articles and statistics define
"primitive culture", so that we can evaluate the data correctly. My best
guess is that the criteria which have been used are a balanced mixture
which appeals to the researcher's peer social environment.
That said, my question was *not* about taking issue because someone got
called prmitive by someone else. What I am after is finding specific
causes and making meaningful inferences.
b) Do we have reasons to assume that all the different cultures which
are collectively labeled as primitive have the same behavior regarding
violence? To be more specific, isn't it possible that the horrifying
numbers come from a couple of particular primitive cultures, plus a
couple more which were caught in a chain of events caused by external
meddling?
c) Statistical data in their raw form is a nasty thing. All it takes is
choosing a suitable categorization which places most of the "bad ones"
in one of your categories. This way, one can support anything.
Statistics is much more than that, but a lot of work needs to be
performed on the raw data. Before drawing a conclusion from a chart like
that one, you have to take a good first guess at picking the significant
variables, make a hypothesis, and use a method such as factor analysis
and check levels of significance, confidence, and lots of more boring
stuff.
BTW, last year we were discussing something related with an unnamed
person right here. The kind of violence we were talking about was taking
the law upon oneself ("terrorism", to use that person's words). Let's
say you live in a place occupied by the enemy tribe. Some members of
your tribe, possibly under the influence of capture bonding (which, BTW,
while well documented, I still think is a pathological phenomenon only
applying to some) or for some other reason become "godfathers" empowered
by the enemy tribe. Their activities are perfectly legal, so some kids
of your tribe take it upon themselves to exterminate them without much
ado. In my opinion, this is an abnormal situation where neither modern
law nor tribal law could provide the much needed safety valve against
the feeling of "unfairness".
So, one case where violence occurs is when the familiar social landscape
breaks down.
I just remembered an incident which happened in Greece some time after
the death sentence was abolished (it had been already practically
inactive for several decades -- convicts were never executed, but it was
still in the book). In a backwards rural district, a retarded aggressive
20 year old boy sexually assaulted and killed a 12 year old boy. He was
arrested and prepared to be sent to the nearest city for trial. The
papers and the villagers called for blood, but there was no death
sentence any more. The papers were saying that the small boy's father,
a relatively old and tired-looking man, would take revenge by himself.
So it happened. A police convoy was carrying the big boy. The old man
was standing in the middle of the road holding a shotgun a few miles
away from the village. The cops got out of the car and stood aside,
while the old man shot the boy and then surrendered.
Afterwords, the villagers and the father of the big boy himself said "It
had to happen. There was no other way for restoring peace." Savages?
Yes, they are. But I believed them when they said that was the best way
to avoid more blood.
As far as I remember, the old man was tried for 5 years in prison or
less.
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